Welcome to the new BlahBlahCafe!

Having trouble registering? You can contact us at the "Contact us" link at the bottom of the page.

Metamorphoses


Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:09 pm
SF01


Posts: 117
Likes received  : 2

Jote wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:51 am
SF01 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:06 am If they opened the multitrack session, but some of the VSTs, or sample libraries were missing, since it's probably on new PC, than no wonder it got messed up.
Very much doubt that was the case. The multitrack sessions are usually stored in plain WAVs. It was probably a session with an "alternate mix", someone just took the wrong file. Mistakes like that happen, some of the quite recent ones include:
  • Oxygene 19 - extra "crash" effects on vinyl, missing on CD
WAVs are only when something was actually recorded from instrument, or digital instrument exported as wav. If it's samples from sample library inserted into project, or made from VST and that VST, or library is missing, then the program won't recreate it. Same if a track is corrupt, or missing...
I once had a concert session lost, because all the WAVs went corrupt...
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 2:39 pm
shadow


User avatar
Posts: 1511
Likes received  : 35

It depends on how they decided to preserve the project files. The session files or the final render. Preferably they'd go for both, but unless we get an official response from anyone that works directly on this, it's just speculation unfortunately.
27-11-10: Ahoy Rotterdam
22-11-16: Heineken Music Hall Amsterdam
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:21 pm
Finaero


User avatar
Posts: 2978
Location: Finland
Likes given: 186
Likes received  : 54

I wonder if the very original GoL release, copies of which were handed out in the club it was made for (or sth), had identical audio to the 2003 release (IIRC, it did).

That said, considering what happened with the first 2014/5 Rendez-Vous remaster, it might just be a case of "okay this seems to be the original album/original album tracks, let's use them" when they compiled the re-releases.

JMJ has expressed his disinterest in revisiting his past work quite often in the past decade or so (possibly a reason why his remasters and "anniversary editions" are very disappointing in the "extra tracks" department - and so many others, of course), he might have thought that the 2001 Essentials & Rarities release was "enough".

(Still can't get over the cancellation of the 2003 PLD DVD release, though in that case it was (probably) less of a "JMJ doesn't want to revisit the past that much" thing...)
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:31 pm
Dr_Jones


User avatar
Posts: 3729
Location: Leiden, Netherlands
Likes given: 194
Likes received  : 402

Finaero wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:21 pm I wonder if the very original GoL release, copies of which were handed out in the club it was made for (or sth), had identical audio to the 2003 release (IIRC, it did).
VIP Room promo? I just checked, it is exactly the same as the 2003 release.
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:57 pm
Finaero


User avatar
Posts: 2978
Location: Finland
Likes given: 186
Likes received  : 54

Dr_Jones wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:31 pm
Finaero wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:21 pm I wonder if the very original GoL release, copies of which were handed out in the club it was made for (or sth), had identical audio to the 2003 release (IIRC, it did).
VIP Room promo? I just checked, it is exactly the same as the 2003 release.
Yeah, that's the one! And thanks for checking it out.

So someone at Dadwater Labs must have gone all "oh, look, here's JeanMichelJarre_GeometryOfLove2003_ThisIsNotTheBloodyFinalMasterWhatAreYouEvenThinking.wav, that must be the final master track that we can use for this new re-release!" :?
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:39 pm
Jote


User avatar
Posts: 1025
Location: Lodz, Poland
Likes given: 55
Likes received  : 68

SF01 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:09 pm WAVs are only when something was actually recorded from instrument, or digital instrument exported as wav. If it's samples from sample library inserted into project, or made from VST and that VST, or library is missing, then the program won't recreate it. Same if a track is corrupt, or missing...
I once had a concert session lost, because all the WAVs went corrupt...
Nobody works with VSTs at that point of production process. Especially when dealing with older albums. You either provide a single mixdown WAV or multiple WAVs if you believe that the mastering engineer could benefit from having a multitrack instead of a mixdown. Reopening the original project after 15 years would make absolutely zero sense if your only goal is to reissue a CD.
Post Posted Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:59 pm
SF01


Posts: 117
Likes received  : 2

Jote wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:39 pm
SF01 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:09 pm WAVs are only when something was actually recorded from instrument, or digital instrument exported as wav. If it's samples from sample library inserted into project, or made from VST and that VST, or library is missing, then the program won't recreate it. Same if a track is corrupt, or missing...
I once had a concert session lost, because all the WAVs went corrupt...
Nobody works with VSTs at that point of production process. Especially when dealing with older albums. You either provide a single mixdown WAV or multiple WAVs if you believe that the mastering engineer could benefit from having a multitrack instead of a mixdown. Reopening the original project after 15 years would make absolutely zero sense if your only goal is to reissue a CD.
Fair point, but has any JMJ reissue made any sense? Left and right channels swapped, bad quality tape transfer, speed inconsistencies, clipping, missing sections, entire acking track not synchronozed with metrum, two parts of one song crossfading in different point in time, artifacts...
Post Posted Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:42 pm
Finaero


User avatar
Posts: 2978
Location: Finland
Likes given: 186
Likes received  : 54

I do like some previously unheard (to me, anyway) tidbits in the more recent remasters, though - for instance, near the end of The Emigrant on the Destination Docklands re-release (around 1:54 on the Spotify version), I think you can hear the Christine Durand soprano bit a bit more clearly than on previous releases (unless you were to edit them on Audacity or something). Could be wrong, though ;)

That said, one reason why I kind of like the 2007 Oxygene remaster is because the bubbling SFX fade-in to Oxygene 5 starts quite a bit later at the end of Oxygene 4 than it does on previous releases.

Sadly, some of the effects in Oxygene 1 are accompanied by loud white noise that is not present on other versions, so I guess I only like Oxygene 4 on the 2007 remaster. ;)
Post Posted Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:45 pm
SF01


Posts: 117
Likes received  : 2

Finaero wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:42 pm I do like some previously unheard (to me, anyway) tidbits in the more recent remasters, though - for instance, near the end of The Emigrant on the Destination Docklands re-release (around 1:54 on the Spotify version), I think you can hear the Christine Durand soprano bit a bit more clearly than on previous releases (unless you were to edit them on Audacity or something). Could be wrong, though ;)

That said, one reason why I kind of like the 2007 Oxygene remaster is because the bubbling SFX fade-in to Oxygene 5 starts quite a bit later at the end of Oxygene 4 than it does on previous releases.

Sadly, some of the effects in Oxygene 1 are accompanied by loud white noise that is not present on other versions, so I guess I only like Oxygene 4 on the 2007 remaster. ;)
2007 is a rerecording, not remaster, at least officially, some people still claim JMJ didn't bother with rerecording it.
Post Posted Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:08 pm
Jote


User avatar
Posts: 1025
Location: Lodz, Poland
Likes given: 55
Likes received  : 68

SF01 wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:45 pm 2007 is a rerecording, not remaster, at least officially, some people still claim JMJ didn't bother with rerecording it.
That's because he didn't. It's not a re-recording. It's a re-mix of the original multitrack recording from 1976. The sounds are EXACTLY the same. The glissandos in Oxygene 1 are the same down to a millisecond precision (can be easily proven by overlaying spectrograms). It's pretty evident it's the original.
Post Posted Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:51 pm
SF01


Posts: 117
Likes received  : 2

Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't.
That would mean the 8-tracks survive, but then again, there's a bit about random noise:
https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/ ... ng.134916/
Post Posted Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:23 pm
Jote


User avatar
Posts: 1025
Location: Lodz, Poland
Likes given: 55
Likes received  : 68

SF01 wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:51 pm Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't.
There's no "maybe". It's not a re-recording, it's a re-mix with several tiny alterations, the evidence is overwhelming.
Post Posted Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:37 pm
Dr_Jones


User avatar
Posts: 3729
Location: Leiden, Netherlands
Likes given: 194
Likes received  : 402

Here's the discussion about it:
https://www.zoolook.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3088
The last page has some interesting info :
https://www.zoolook.nl/forum/viewtopic. ... 86#p199186
Post Posted Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:25 am
SF01


Posts: 117
Likes received  : 2

Great, I've been living a lie...
But I can see how one could bend the reality and justify the name "New Master Recording", after all, it is a recording of a new master "tape" for pressing, indeed the "rerecording" is not mentioned anywhere.
Post Posted Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:51 am
Dr_Jones


User avatar
Posts: 3729
Location: Leiden, Netherlands
Likes given: 194
Likes received  : 402

SF01 wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:25 am Great, I've been living a lie...
But I can see how one could bend the reality and justify the name "New Master Recording", after all, it is a recording of a new master "tape" for pressing, indeed the "rerecording" is not mentioned anywhere.
It's like they say "Ignorance is bliss" :-)

It turned out it's all a rights thing. But all in all I was very happy with the 2007 Oxygene release since we got the Live in Your Living Room DVD and one of my most memorable moments: the Marigny concerts.







  • 2020 Zoolook.nl
    Powered by phpBB forum software